To cairn or not to cairn

Bushwalking topics that are not location specific.
Forum rules
The place for bushwalking topics that are not location specific.

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby ofuros » Sun 27 Jan, 2019 4:39 pm

In this case...just another form of graffiti beside the track. :roll:
Bald Rock N.P, NSW.

DSCF4870 copy (Medium).jpg
DSCF4870 copy (Medium).jpg (155.54 KiB) Viewed 16564 times
Mountain views are good for my soul...& getting to them is good for my waistline !
https://ofuros.exposure.co/
User avatar
ofuros
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1865
Joined: Fri 05 Feb, 2010 4:42 pm
Region: Queensland
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Rexyviney36 » Tue 29 Jan, 2019 10:25 am

I have a love/hate relationship with them.
As a kid I loved walking to Hamilton's Crag at Ben Lomond and putting a small rock on the top of the well-made cairn there. When the snow was really good we would carry our downhill skis up there and ski down.
In April 2018, I hated that the track marking the way from Lake Myrtle to Lake Meston was mostly 3 or 4 rock cairns which were useless in the foot of snow...having only walkd up there once before (no snow), it was tough to say the least.
Rexyviney36
Athrotaxis cupressoides
Athrotaxis cupressoides
 
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon 21 Jan, 2019 11:33 am
Region: Tasmania

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Warin » Mon 04 Mar, 2019 12:49 pm

I think I'd like cairns made by this fellow
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-devon-47318521
Image
User avatar
Warin
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1253
Joined: Sat 11 Nov, 2017 8:02 am
Region: New South Wales

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby crollsurf » Fri 17 Jan, 2020 7:03 am

User avatar
crollsurf
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1837
Joined: Tue 07 Mar, 2017 10:07 am
Location: Sydney
Region: New South Wales
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby ofuros » Fri 17 Jan, 2020 7:15 am

A self centred, senseless instagrammable phenomenon...leave nature as is, especially in Np's.
Mountain views are good for my soul...& getting to them is good for my waistline !
https://ofuros.exposure.co/
User avatar
ofuros
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1865
Joined: Fri 05 Feb, 2010 4:42 pm
Region: Queensland
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby drewmac » Sat 21 Mar, 2020 6:11 pm

ofuros wrote:A self centred, senseless instagrammable phenomenon...leave nature as is, especially in Np's.


Likewise.

I go in the bush to get away from humanity.

But.....alas..... I think here in this forum we are talking/preaching to the converted......
___________________________________________
Drew
drewmac
Atherosperma moschatum
Atherosperma moschatum
 
Posts: 57
Joined: Tue 10 Jun, 2014 12:32 pm
Region: Queensland
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Baka Dasai » Sat 21 Mar, 2020 6:33 pm

Cairns, and all human-created stuff, is just as "natural" as anything else. I'm not against them per se, but wanky Instagram rock-stacking irks me as much as the puritanical tendency for some to define nature as "devoid of human impact".

Like everything, it's a balance.
User avatar
Baka Dasai
Nothofagus gunnii
Nothofagus gunnii
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed 01 Jan, 2020 1:22 pm
Region: New South Wales

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Heremeahappy1 » Sat 21 Mar, 2020 8:20 pm

Just don't do it.
Heremeahappy1
Athrotaxis cupressoides
Athrotaxis cupressoides
 
Posts: 218
Joined: Tue 21 Nov, 2017 6:26 am
Location: Gippsland
Region: Victoria
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Orion » Wed 25 Mar, 2020 11:19 pm

They're really great.....











....to kick!

That one Warin posted a photo of would be so much fun to topple!! Where can I find those?
Orion
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1963
Joined: Mon 02 Feb, 2009 12:33 pm
Region: Other Country

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby GregG » Thu 26 Mar, 2020 1:50 pm

I still come across a lot of these in my neck of the woods and they tend to keep being rebuilt in the same locations, mainly by narcissistic overseas backpackers and it seems that creation of the cairn is merely a vehicle for the constructor to display the fruits of their simple mindedness on social media. I delight in destroying them, such fun.
GregG
Phyllocladus aspleniifolius
Phyllocladus aspleniifolius
 
Posts: 620
Joined: Sat 09 Nov, 2019 6:44 pm
ASSOCIATED ORGANISATIONS: Old bushie
Region: New South Wales
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby tomh » Sun 26 Jun, 2022 10:08 am

tomh
Athrotaxis cupressoides
Athrotaxis cupressoides
 
Posts: 150
Joined: Wed 02 Jun, 2010 3:44 pm
Region: Queensland
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Joynz » Sun 26 Jun, 2022 4:14 pm

At the completion of my recent Larapinta Trail walk, I noticed a small cairn at the very top of Mt Sonder. Just a couple of metres past the formal stone structure there. Absolutely no need for it!

Naturally, I took direct action to remedy the situation :-)
Joynz
Athrotaxis cupressoides
Athrotaxis cupressoides
 
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed 23 Oct, 2019 12:46 am
Region: Victoria

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Waratah67 » Wed 29 Jun, 2022 2:56 pm

Cairns are a traditionally used for survey and navigation. Many bushwalking routes which are now built tracks were originally established with cairns at key points. Often these were constructed by indigenous peoples prior to that to aid trader routes etc. Cairn like structures were also important in ceremony, animal traps etc. Many of these historic cairns still exist in the landscape, and should be preserved for inherent value.

It's easy to develop a "hatred" for cairns, and I understand it when applied to some of the excessive and ridiculous multiple cairn structures. However, if you knock down every cairn you see, you will be very likely to have also damaged our heritage at some point.

Single cairn structures, particularly if old and lichen encrusted should be treated with respect. If they are to be removed, it should be left to the land managers themselves to do so.
Attachments
28762998942_e5758f793f_k.jpg
Near Mt Feathertop
Waratah67
Nothofagus cunninghamii
Nothofagus cunninghamii
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue 24 Nov, 2020 10:02 am
Region: New South Wales
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby epiclad25 » Wed 20 Jul, 2022 2:44 pm

I would argue that cairns are important for navigation and are the best way to protect the environment whilst ensuring walkers can get where they need to go. of course unnecessary cairns are both a waste of time and a risk to walkers as they may lead you off the path but its important that we mark a route. Cairns also mean that we don't bring stuff like plastic markers and stuff in which run the risk of contaminating the environment. Finally, walking should be made as accessible as possible and that means marking routes so that beginners know where to go. just because you have the navigational prowess to make cains obsolete doesn't mean that inly you should walk. I was angry to hear that cairns had been removed on the direct ascent of federation peak. that's life threatening as if someone takes the wrong route they could fall to their death.
epiclad25
Nothofagus gunnii
Nothofagus gunnii
 
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun 01 Mar, 2020 3:38 pm
Region: Queensland
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby rcaffin » Thu 21 Jul, 2022 9:24 am

walking should be made as accessible as possible and that means marking routes so that beginners know where to go.
I am not sure there is any logic or sense behind this statement.
Personally, I think you should have to work for it.

Cheers
Roger
User avatar
rcaffin
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1129
Joined: Thu 17 Jul, 2008 3:46 pm

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby rcaffin » Thu 21 Jul, 2022 9:35 am

Sue and I have a sort of theory about pink tape. If we see some then we know we are lost.

Cheers
Roger
User avatar
rcaffin
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1129
Joined: Thu 17 Jul, 2008 3:46 pm

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby tastrax » Thu 21 Jul, 2022 12:22 pm

epiclad25 wrote:I would argue that cairns are important for navigation and are the best way to protect the environment whilst ensuring walkers can get where they need to go. of course unnecessary cairns are both a waste of time and a risk to walkers as they may lead you off the path but its important that we mark a route. Cairns also mean that we don't bring stuff like plastic markers and stuff in which run the risk of contaminating the environment. Finally, walking should be made as accessible as possible and that means marking routes so that beginners know where to go. just because you have the navigational prowess to make cains obsolete doesn't mean that inly you should walk. I was angry to hear that cairns had been removed on the direct ascent of federation peak. that's life threatening as if someone takes the wrong route they could fall to their death.


Sorry, but that is a load of rubbish. If you need cairns to know where to go then you probably shouldn't be in the area in the first place. Parks agencies are there to manage a range of experiences from high grade nature trails all the way to off track, unsigned, no infrastructure opportunities. Placing cairns has just as much likelihood of getting an inexperienced walker in trouble by making them feel they are capable of being in a remote area. When the cairns run out they may well not have the skills to keep themselves safe. Without cairns, its also likely there will be some dispersal of impacts and if numbers are kept low that impact may be negligible. The moment cairns are installed then impacts will likely increase.

Enjoy all the areas you are capable of walking and also learn the skills to go to remote untracked country. Its a privilege that walkers in many countries no longer enjoy.
Cheers - Phil

OSM Mapper
User avatar
tastrax
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1992
Joined: Fri 28 Mar, 2008 6:25 pm
Location: What3words - epic.constable.downplayed
ASSOCIATED ORGANISATIONS: RETIRED! - Parks and Wildlife Service
Region: Tasmania

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby gbagua » Thu 21 Jul, 2022 12:59 pm

Cairns the traditional way in remote mountain tracks are a joy to see.

Image

The one Ofuros depicted and the evil pink tape are an abomination!
User avatar
gbagua
Athrotaxis cupressoides
Athrotaxis cupressoides
 
Posts: 475
Joined: Sat 20 Oct, 2012 9:04 pm
Region: Queensland

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby ofuros » Thu 21 Jul, 2022 7:20 pm

Did someone mention my name. :D

Most National Park's websites have 'Leave no trace or Caring for Parks info' buried deep within...should be alot easier to access.
Quick search...some are better than others. :roll:

Qld - https://parks.des.qld.gov.au/things-to- ... ting-parks

NSW - https://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/co ... -for-parks

Vic - https://www.parks.vic.gov.au/accessibil ... sy-english

TAS - https://parks.tas.gov.au/explore-our-pa ... e-no-trace

SA - https://www.parks.sa.gov.au/insider-tip ... p-in-parks

WA - https://exploreparks.dbca.wa.gov.au/caring-our-parks

NT - https://nt.gov.au/parks/safety-rules
Mountain views are good for my soul...& getting to them is good for my waistline !
https://ofuros.exposure.co/
User avatar
ofuros
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1865
Joined: Fri 05 Feb, 2010 4:42 pm
Region: Queensland
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby crollsurf » Thu 21 Jul, 2022 10:37 pm

Not a fan but let the land managers sort it out. Some have historically significance, some are useful for navigation, Some are useless but have built an ecology around them.

Walk on by. Enjoy your walk.

Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk
User avatar
crollsurf
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1837
Joined: Tue 07 Mar, 2017 10:07 am
Location: Sydney
Region: New South Wales
Gender: Male

Re: To cairn or not to cairn

Postby Orion » Fri 22 Jul, 2022 1:32 am

If non-official people can set them up then I can knock them down. It's perfectly legit.

I agree that there are cases where cairns make sense and I leave those ones alone and even, on occasion, add one. For example, a trail that briefly becomes ambiguous. It's already a trail. A cairn there just keeps people on the established path. GPS apps can do the same thing but not quite as quickly.

I've placed them in the past to aid in descent from a complicated mountain route, fully intending to remove them on the way down... only to go down a different way and leave all my errant cairns as a lesson to be learned by the next party. (sorry!)

When I've visited Australia I have left them alone. It's not my country.
Orion
Athrotaxis selaginoides
Athrotaxis selaginoides
 
Posts: 1963
Joined: Mon 02 Feb, 2009 12:33 pm
Region: Other Country

Previous

Return to Bushwalking Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests